Vegas Mafia Day One

[Vanta Black]

All right. People coming in with an early kind of "Hi I'm town" post always makes me think of "Hello fellow kids" (Buscemi, I think? Obviously not a kid, masquerading as one). So in that respect I can see TexCat's vote on Maha. But the way it followed Colby's vote/unvote did not look great.

I hope we haven't scared Kaiveran off.

Tone is hard to read in a text-based game but BC's seems okay. I could be still reading him in my everyone-is-town mindset.

I thought the deadline was 5pm Central, that is more than an hour away right?

I have to go do something else for a couple of hours but I will come back and vote if there's still time. In a pinch I could phone vote but that hasn't gone well for me in the past.

Also OOG, I read somebody's "oog fluff" as "Dog fluff" I have a lot of experience with dog fluff especially this time of year.

[guiri]

Originally Posted by gnarlycharlie

Is it just me but you always seem irritated when you reply to me? I suppose my playstyle (or lack of one) can be frustrating.

No irritation, trying to decide whether you’re intentionally twisting reality to suit an agenda, or we’re just taking past each other.

Originally Posted by gnarlycharlie

At any rate, I find your questioning my wincon irrelevant because 1) if I weren't Town, I wouldn't admit it was different and 2) much more importantly, it doesn't matter simply because I'm questioning your assumption about the meaning of the word 'forces.' It implies you do know something not mentioned in the VT wincon.

It’s probably my matter-of-fact tone and desire to put the facts straight… when I’m mistaken I’m usually quick to say “my bad” and move on.

Originally Posted by gnarlycharlie

My reason is as good as any for D1. I was really more interested in the reactions of other players, whether they would agree and even vote with me or disagree. There hasn't been much either way. Your reaction has been more surprising. It's a non-issue for most everyone but you seem to be defending yourself a tad vigorously.

It’s a game of mafia, we’re looking for liars, some people look very carefully, others skim, and others don’t look at all so will hop on any arguments that are proposed by others. My job is to hunt scum, but also to try to find other town, and help other town find me.

[guiri]

Neta and other anti-town forces 😂

[guiri]

Originally Posted by Vanta Black

Don't quite get this question but...maybe?

I think if rephrased Archangel meant "thought experiment me as town..."

I was referring to this:

Originally Posted by Archangel

But it's not okay because all along you've been saying it bothered you because you thought I was asking if I played with him before.

Now you're saying it's because asking if it was an alt account is disingenuous. That feels like moving the goalposts.

Which bothered you, that she asked if they’d played before or that she asked if he was an alt?

[guiri]

Originally Posted by Archangel

Is the vote-counting robot not working anymore? I'm getting something weird but it could be my firewall.

Works for me:

Originally Posted by Vote Counting Robot

Texcat (3): guiri (113), Mahaloth (118), Mordenkainen (189)
Vanta Black (2): Colby11 (72), LightFoot (114), Archangel (148)[190]
Mahaloth (1): Colby11 (28)[28], TexCat (35), Meeko (45)[75]
Guiri (1): gnarlycharlie (13)
Archangel (1): guiri (23)[40], Meeko (100), Vanta Black (108)[187]
Gnarlycharlie (1): Silverjan (136)
Guri (1): Precambrianmollusc (151)
Precambrianmollusc (0): Archangel (89)[148]
Meeko (0): Vanta Black (37)[108]

[Archangel]

Originally Posted by guiri

Works for me:

Thank you! It's my firewall then.

[Archangel]

So TexCat has 3 and you (Guiri) and Vanta have 2 each.

Texcat's wagon is the most pure to me.

Vanta's wagon could be anything because Colby and LightFoot have both been low participation. (LightFoot sounds like her town game when she was ill before though.)

Guiri wagon is the least pure to me.

Meh. I want to vote Vanta again so we have a tie and people have to commit but I really don't think he's scum after the last bit.

Let me go reread TexCat and Charlie.

[Eristic Widgeon]

4 minutes to go…

[Archangel]

This is off the cuff but Jan, I'm at least listening to you, and the "I think Jan is town in spite of her voting me" is something I do as scum.

TexCat could go either way, I'm just not sure.

[guiri]

Originally Posted by Eristic Widgeon

4 minutes to go…

Is it 5pm Chicago?

[guiri]

I thought we had like 3 hours left in the Day.

[Eristic Widgeon]

Yikes! I somehow thought the deadline was 2. Thanks, guiri, I was seconds away from flipping TexCat!

[Eristic Widgeon]

So yes, 3 hours to go! Carry on.

[gnarlycharlie]

Originally Posted by Archangel

This is off the cuff but Jan, I'm at least listening to you, and the "I think Jan is town in spite of her voting me" is something I do as scum.



TexCat could go either way, I'm just not sure.

But I'm not you...

[Archangel]

Originally Posted by gnarlycharlie

But I'm not you...

True but I thought the day was ending. Now I have a couple hours to figure out what to do.

[Vanta Black]

This is a test

[Vanta Black]

Originally Posted by guiri

Which bothered you, that she asked if they’d played before or that she asked if he was an alt?

It was kinda tone and kinda something else, let me see. Okay, (1) if someone is playing as an alt they have made some kind of choice to do that and it might be to hide their meta, so something piqued me about that question in the first place, and then (b) she asked a very specific question about what order Kai answered posts and didn't sound (to me!) like she really cared about the answer, in part because (iii) she didn't care to know this about any other player in the game.

Whew.

(My previous post was seeing if I could get here on my phone, 'cause I could not get here on my computer, but now it looks like I can...)

[guiri]

Site was not responding for me either.

You’ve every right to extend your case on someone as new evidence is available, but now it seems you’re adding a third accusation? Let me go back and review for myself. I note you’ve unvoted Archangel and have yet to vote.

[Vanta Black]

Originally Posted by Archangel

So TexCat has 3 and you (Guiri) and Vanta have 2 each.

Texcat's wagon is the most pure to me.

Vanta's wagon could be anything because Colby and LightFoot have both been low participation. (LightFoot sounds like her town game when she was ill before though.)

Guiri wagon is the least pure to me.

Meh. I want to vote Vanta again so we have a tie and people have to commit but I really don't think he's scum after the last bit.

Let me go reread TexCat and Charlie.

Re: bolded part, you mean the game she played largely from a hospital bed while on painkillers? She was not town in that game!

But her vote on me makes me think she's probably town this game, I don't think she'd make that vote if she knew I was town.

[Vanta Black]

Originally Posted by guiri

Site was not responding for me either.

You’ve every right to extend your case on someone as new evidence is available, but now it seems you’re adding a third accusation? Let me go back and review for myself. I note you’ve unvoted Archangel and have yet to vote.

I am not adding a third accusation!

Let me clarify (or muddy further as the case may be): AA's original post and followup struck me as false. But then I remembered that she had done almost exactly this in a previous game, but I couldn't remember if she was town or scum in that game. I just looked it up; she was town in that game. That may have shifted my thinking, and could still be wrong. She's a very good scum player.

[guiri]

Originally Posted by Kaiveran

Coming back for more later. Gonna need some more sleep if I'm to survive tonight at work.

It’s almost time for bed again, wake up!

[guiri]

Originally Posted by Archangel

4. I liked Mordenkainen's post, which seems like his (Mordenkainen's) town game, and I think his analysis is good. So unless Mordenkainen and Kaiveran are exactly the scum team, which we need more information to assess, I'm good with Kaiveran right now.

This is worded awkwardly?

[Vanta Black]

I'm gonna stand by my policy non-vote of Kaiveran toDay but if they don't get back here toot sweet I could get behind Kaiveran in some future phase.

[guiri]

Nothing to see here, keeping for reference.

I don’t see any earlier mention of the “Do I know you?” question before this where Vanta questions Archangel’s question to Kaiverian, asks for reasoning. Originally Posted by Vanta Black This seems like a very specific question that you don't really care about the answer to. The reason it seems like that is because you want to know this about Kaiveran but you admit right there that you don't know this specific posting thing about anyone else. So what is the reasoning? I posit she’s noticed something: Originally Posted by guiri I'm guessing she's noticed something in post #38 and is waiting for the response before explaining herself. And Archangel confirms this is the case: Originally Posted by Archangel No, I am getting at something. I’ll share it after I get his answer. He answered, Archangel explained motivation behind question: Originally Posted by Archangel @Kaiveran thank you for your detailed explanation. I should have been able to figure this out from your multiquotes (when I went back to look at the post I can see them, but I'm on a desktop now and I didn't notice them on my phone). But I'm good with you now. At everyone else except Meeko but especially Vanta, I was asking this question because he (Kaiveran) was continuing to respond to the question "do I know you" after I already posted my explanation, which to me is a scum tell. It's a way to discuss things and look productive but be noncommital. But now that he's explained his process to me I think he just answered the question when he saw it, and then got to my response later. @Meeko my process is my process and you are jumping to incorrect or malicious conclusions. I'm allowed to ask questions, and as Kaiveran is a player in this game, he is not off-limits from suspicion. #108 is your vote, questioning whether Kaiverian actually continued to explain himself or just did it once in that multi-quote post: Originally Posted by Vanta Black Could you highlight where he did this? Because I only see one response addressing this from Kaiveran, not a "continuing" response. And a clarification: Originally Posted by Archangel By continuing I mean specifically that he explained he likes to use multi quote. To use multi quote you compose a post but you continue to read and you don’t finish the post/publish it until the end. What I mean is that he answered my question when he quoted me but it’s possible/likely that he continued to read the thread and respond and then just posted the entire thing without going back and editing it. This exchange: Originally Posted by Archangel Please explain. I’ve answered all your questions fully and you haven’t responded to my responses but post this? Explain in detail. Originally Posted by Archangel I'm not scum and I prefer him over TexCat. I don't believe that he thinks the scum team is exactly TexCat and I. And an explanation, raising the alt accusation as a scum tell, some confusion still about why Archangel was asking about catch-up style: Originally Posted by Vanta Black Well, it's a guessing game. This is a guess. Based on (1) your questions to Kaiveran, which looked like they were supposed to look like scum hunting, and (2) TexCat's quick me-too vote on Mahaloth. I don't understand why you thought Kaiveran's writing style was scummy. A lot of players reply with multiquote, it's not alien or anything. Thinking he might be an alt seemed really disingenuous which is something I see more in scum than town. As he only had like three posts at the time it was trivially easy to see that his first couple of posts were in connection with askthepizzaguy's mafia guide and indicated both that he had read the guide and that he knew/followed pizza in a MU game, that's kind of a lot of information already. And question answered, no goalpost moving, Vanta never expressed any suspicion of the “have we played before?” question. Spoilering this since it seems to be a dead end.

[guiri]

What conclusions can we draw when the primary yeet candidate is not around at EoD and possibly unaware she’s up, and there’s little or no vote movement to indicate a save or a push on an alternate candidate?

AA, you thought the Day was ending and placed a last minute vote on gnarly, pushing him one behind TexCat, are you still null on TexCat?

[Vanta Black]

Originally Posted by guiri

Is it 5pm Chicago?

Originally Posted by Vanta Black

Wait, ONE HOUR? I am confused

Look how well I am blending in! I am invisible! (Note time stamps on my post and guiri's)

[Vanta Black]

Off to walk a dog, and there could be fireworks (actual), and I don't know how she reacts to fireworks.

All this is by way of saying I might not be back for EoD, whenever it is. If she doesn't mind fireworks the walk will be longer. So

The National Weather Service has issued an Avalanche warning for the Tampa Bay area TONIGHT, take cover! And why does Florida even have an ice hockey team anyway? Asking as a Coloradan. But this is why fireworks, a bit premature IMO but they're out there

[guiri]

Originally Posted by Vanta Black

Off to walk a dog, and there could be fireworks (actual), and I don't know how she reacts to fireworks.

All this is by way of saying I might not be back for EoD, whenever it is. If she doesn't mind fireworks the walk will be longer. So

I was so confused, thanks Google.

[guiri]

Anyone around?

[TexCat]

I'm around, but it appears I won't be for long.

[TexCat]

My gut is still telling me that Mahaloth is scum.

[guiri]

Originally Posted by gnarlycharlie

I don't understand your logic. You did bring up the idea of a 3rd party first. Now you're wondering why I'm questioning it? Why is your first thought that there are 3rd parties when it could have been the other possibilities I've mentioned? To repeat, those are that there may be two scum teams or the mod was merely meant that there are more than one scum.

As an aside, did anyone consider anti-town forces to mean two scum teams or forces to be a reference to individual scum team members?

I’ll happily switch my vote to gnarly, this feels like tortured reasoning to explain away the flaw in his vote, but prefer to avoid a tie.

[guiri]

Originally Posted by TexCat

My gut is still telling me that Mahaloth is scum.

Are you scum? Give me a reason to move off you onto Gnarly.

Not seeing the Mahaloth thing but, like so many others. he’s not given lots to go on.

[guiri]

Or could I ask your thoughts on the other top candidates? Myself, Gnarlycharlie and Vanta.

[TexCat]

I am not scum.

[TexCat]

I think you and Vanta are town. So little to go on with Gnarly .. idk but I'd switch.

My best guesses are Mahaloth and BC.

[TexCat]

[TexCat]

A feeble attempt and self preservation. I'm sure I'm not scum.

[guiri]

Feeling slightly better about this now. Sorry if this cuts your return short.

[gnarlycharlie]

[gnarlycharlie]

I'm Town as well.

[guiri]

That sort of solidifies my vote

[guiri]

As well.

[gnarlycharlie]

If I go, you're public enemy #1.

[guiri]

I think it’s a tie

[gnarlycharlie]

Either you're scum or you're losing your mojo.

[guiri]

I don’t have a 100% D1 record…

[guiri]

Who Posted?
Total Posts: 247
User Name Posts
guiri 55
Archangel 41
Vanta Black 33
Meeko 20
LightFoot 12
TexCat 12
Silverjan 12
gnarlycharlie 11
Mordenkainen 11
Eristic Widgeon 9
Mahaloth 8
Precambrianmollusc 8
Colby11 5
Kaiveran 5
Bashorian Clement 5

Although maybe I should shut up a little.

[Archangel]

Originally Posted by guiri

This is worded awkwardly?

It’s a commonish phrase here? I mean that the scum team is Mordenkainen and Kaiveran and not anyone else

[Mordenkainen]

Originally Posted by guiri

As an aside, did anyone consider anti-town forces to mean two scum teams or forces to be a reference to individual scum team members?

I considered it as a possibility, but alngside the possibility of a three-faction game - specifically a third-party. Multiple Mafia teams seemed unlikely.

I wouldn't be changing my vote now even if it wasn't too late.