Greek History Mafia N2

[Visorslash]

Brave Achilles, Greek Hero was left to die.

Lightfoot was Achilles, town one shot vigilante.

48 hours for night, 8pm 10th of august.

Send in your orders, even if it is nothing - so I can open earlier

[guiri]

Oh, farewell Lightfoot.

[lulz]

So it's double visions all over again.

[Meeko]

Originally Posted by lulz

So it's double visions all over again.

I'd suggest you stop drinking if you are still having double visions.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I should feel bad but I don't. Simply refused vote anyone but my villagers.

[Askthepizzaguy]

If you want to find mafia I'm a wasted investigation.

Don't bother looking here. Don't look at the folks I've been defending either.

Look at the folks who wanted to lynch Lulz and Double A, somewhere in there.

It's a much wider list of people and my bet for where the actual scums are hiding, plus some villagers. Differentiating between those people is important.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Look at Drink, Scathach, SisterCoyote in my opinion to find scum or at least get suspicions moved off of them. But if you think I have an agenda then don't, go for someone who is more neutral.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Meeko, I think enough time has passed for you to get a handle on things.

What do you think is going on here?

Specifically, is Pizza defending his scum crew, is pizza the scumbag defending villagers, or is pizza, double a and lulz all a bunch of villagers?

I'm curious. Because as loud as I've been, I've really struggled to make an impact here- I've pointed out all kinds of reasons to defend Double A and Lulz, but it's not changing a lot of minds.

Look at this first- I am a villager.

Let's say I'm wrong about double a and lulz. They're scum, or one of them is.

Don't you think the scumbags on their team would be like yeah, Pizza, you're right, they are less scummy than I thought. And not try to keep trying to lynch them every round?

If they are scum and I'm a villager, either one of them, who is their teammate at this point?

It's really easy for the scums to hang back here and deny momentum to the village. It was obvious to me that the day one lynches were both going nowhere. And then we still follow up with double a and lulz, and then I couldn't get lightfoot to even remove herself from that equation, she basically decided she'd rather die than give any other scum suspect of mine a chance.

So that's village.

I see that. So where's the scums?

Who is benefiting from this dynamic?

[Meeko]

Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

Meeko, I think enough time has passed for you to get a handle on things.

What do you think is going on here?

Specifically, is Pizza defending his scum crew, is pizza the scumbag defending villagers, or is pizza, double a and lulz all a bunch of villagers?

I'm curious. Because as loud as I've been, I've really struggled to make an impact here- I've pointed out all kinds of reasons to defend Double A and Lulz, but it's not changing a lot of minds

Snipped.

My whole entire position is that this game guzzled down jet fuel and shot itself into outer space on day one. Some of us are playing mid to late game, and in actuality, it's barely out of the gate. We are suffering for it as a result.

I think scum is getting away with everything, and that whatever it is that they are doing, they are doing it right, and at this point, will win. But at least we can read the scum board after and it will be a one time deal.

I was thinking I was confused as to how fast this game was going, but I think the rest of town is even more confused. Do I get off the sidelines, and help mislynch? I would think not.

I'm confused, and you have a struggle. I wonder if at a point in time, confused and struggle don't overlap.

[Meeko]

In summary, this is how I feel scum is playing this game.

https://imgur.com/tRXf4CQ

[guiri]

Originally Posted by Meeko

My whole entire position is that this game guzzled down jet fuel and shot itself into outer space on day one. Some of us are playing mid to late game, and in actuality, it's barely out of the gate. We are suffering for it as a result.

Is this solely due to end of Day votes changes to prevent a tie? Or did something massive happen on D1 that I somehow missed?

Originally Posted by Archangel

I would be convinced you were scum if not for the fact that you tried to get Lightfoot to save herself (although that would be an excellent scum play if you knew lulz and DoubleA were town). I'm going with Occam's Razor, which makes you town.

With Lightfoot flipping Town, I have to agree with this but the option was to join Pizza on Scathach or go on her own on Double A.

Originally Posted by Dizzymrslizzy

As I said before. Lightfoot was Town, and I wish I was up in the middle of the night to swing it.

Lulz, Guiri, pizza all look guilty as hell.

You said Lightfoot was Town and expected people to believe you and unvote just like that? And we're guilty of mislynching her, sure, is that it?

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

I thought it was pretty apparent lightfoot was town when she basically refused to save herself by changing her vote. Yet pizza kept his vote on her. So because of that, pizza is rising in my eyes as potential Scum.

Well, hindsight and all that, but Pizza was pushing Lightfoot and Scathach as scum, what was he expecting her to say by offering her the choice to lynch her scumbuddy instead of herself?

[Archangel]

Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

Meeko, I think enough time has passed for you to get a handle on things.

What do you think is going on here?

Specifically, is Pizza defending his scum crew, is pizza the scumbag defending villagers, or is pizza, double a and lulz all a bunch of villagers?

I'm curious. Because as loud as I've been, I've really struggled to make an impact here- I've pointed out all kinds of reasons to defend Double A and Lulz, but it's not changing a lot of minds.

Look at this first- I am a villager.

Let's say I'm wrong about double a and lulz. They're scum, or one of them is.

Don't you think the scumbags on their team would be like yeah, Pizza, you're right, they are less scummy than I thought. And not try to keep trying to lynch them every round?

If they are scum and I'm a villager, either one of them, who is their teammate at this point?

It's really easy for the scums to hang back here and deny momentum to the village. It was obvious to me that the day one lynches were both going nowhere. And then we still follow up with double a and lulz, and then I couldn't get lightfoot to even remove herself from that equation, she basically decided she'd rather die than give any other scum suspect of mine a chance.

So that's village.

I see that. So where's the scums?

Who is benefiting from this dynamic?

I would be convinced you were scum if not for the fact that you tried to get Lightfoot to save herself (although that would be an excellent scum play if you knew lulz and DoubleA were town). I'm going with Occam's Razor, which makes you town.

DoubleA is on my short list after this. Unlike you, I think there is scum on the leading lynch candidates and that the swings moved on to town both days.

My top scum candidates are Idrink, DoubleA, and Sario. Scathach is moving up my list.

[idrinkthere4iam]

Originally Posted by Archangel

I would be convinced you were scum if not for the fact that you tried to get Lightfoot to save herself (although that would be an excellent scum play if you knew lulz and DoubleA were town). I'm going with Occam's Razor, which makes you town.

DoubleA is on my short list after this. Unlike you, I think there is scum on the leading lynch candidates and that the swings moved on to town both days.

My top scum candidates are Idrink, DoubleA, and Sario. Scathach is moving up my list.

No comment on my comments regarding your suspicion of me? Ignoring them, or just didn't see them?

[Archangel]

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

No comment on my comments regarding your suspicion of me? Ignoring them, or just didn't see them?

I saw them, replied in my head, and then never posted my response. Going back to respond now, sorry.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Oh I suppose I'll hard claim Socrates the vanilla townie at this point.

Just my gut, that's all so far.

You have other vigilantes? You think pizza and crew are scums? You could at least deny day three being round three of this same BS.

You won't hit a scumbag unless I'm really really off my game this game. But objectively speaking I am not.

Investigate or vig kill inside my suspects for great justice.

[Visorslash]

I am a trafficker of information, I know everything I can. The question is, do you know why you are here?

[Askthepizzaguy]

I'm here because I was born and haven't died yet.

[Dizzymrslizzy]

pizza I love you but I'd waste an investigation on you or lulz anyway. 😍😍😍

As I said before. Lightfoot was Town, and I wish I was up in the middle of the night to swing it.

Lulz, Guiri, pizza all look guilty as hell.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Originally Posted by Dizzymrslizzy

pizza I love you but I'd waste an investigation on you or lulz anyway. 😍😍😍

As I said before. Lightfoot was Town, and I wish I was up in the middle of the night to swing it.

Lulz, Guiri, pizza all look guilty as hell.

Dizzy, I gave you a pass on tone for Lulz. I can't keep doing that.

I need a lot more from you Day Three. A lot more.

I need your help. I need you to also recognize why I need your help in this situation, and why I need more from you.

If this is not okay then if you are a villager we are going to lose this game together.

[LightFoot]

Damn my foot hurts! " shakes fist" Avenge me!

[Archangel]

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

Previously stated? This?

Bandwagon started when Double A jumped on the vote immediately. And didn't really explain why. But since I was reasonable about my reason, I'm the Scum. Got it. Thanks for clarifying. Maybe I should just blind vote next time. That couldn't possibly make me appear Scummy. Shall we ask lulz how that tactic works? Everyone is trying to look reasonable. Don't agree with it, that's fine. But don't accuse me of being Scum because I'm backing up what I say. That's hypocritical.

If I'm wrong I apologize, I can understand where you are frustrated if you're town and getting called out for making a reasonable argument. This post struck me as very defensive, though, and I'm not sure why it would have to be, since there's no momentum growing on a lynch for you (apart from Pizza apparently adding you to his short list).

This and the next post (where you describe your play style) almost convinced me I was wrong about you, but one thing bothers me about it. You were paying careful enough attention to the voting on Day One to be able to tell me that DoubleA jumped on your vote on Zeener a few posts after (and in your opinion created the bandwagon), yet this wasn't cited as a reason for voting him. That's a big thing to notice and yet not comment on until it's made an issue of (by me).

That being said, I think we need a reveal of lulz or DoubleA toMorrow in order to figure out what's going on here and I think DoubleA should go first. (I think Pizza's tunneling on him being innocent and this he's escaping doom.)

[idrinkthere4iam]

Originally Posted by Archangel

This and the next post (where you describe your play style) almost convinced me I was wrong about you, but one thing bothers me about it. You were paying careful enough attention to the voting on Day One to be able to tell me that DoubleA jumped on your vote on Zeener a few posts after (and in your opinion created the bandwagon), yet this wasn't cited as a reason for voting him. That's a big thing to notice and yet not comment on until it's made an issue of (by me).

I was keeping that in my back pocket. I wanted to see Double As reaction to my vote. Or see if anyone tries to defend him. When it became apparent I was not going to be lynched I just held it back all together to post toMorrow.

Speaking of defending Double A, pizza was a big supporter of keeping him alive. My vote for Double A even seems to have gotten me on his short list. But he was more focused on others. I thought it was pretty apparent lightfoot was town when she basically refused to save herself by changing her vote. Yet pizza kept his vote on her. So because of that, pizza is rising in my eyes as potential Scum.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

So because of that, pizza is rising in my eyes as potential Scum.

Then I propose the investigation be on me, or on you, and no one else.

How's that?

[idrinkthere4iam]

Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

Then I propose the investigation be on me, or on you, and no one else.

How's that?

If it's on me then it'll be a waste as you say. As I am town. But to each their own. I won't begin to tell others how to use their powers or play the game. Especially when I don't even know what to do myself.

[Archangel]

Pizza, why did you claim now? If you're town you've created enough controversy that surely scum will want to keep you alive for another day. Or was that claim in response to the idea that you were soft-claiming mason?

[Askthepizzaguy]

Originally Posted by Archangel

Pizza, why did you claim now? If you're town you've created enough controversy that surely scum will want to keep you alive for another day. Or was that claim in response to the idea that you were soft-claiming mason?

If I were a scumbag I would want to at least keep a claim of cop, tracker, watcher, etc etc etc on the table.

basically I understand that I am now "hard" to read as a townie because I was the decider (tm) and have been hard defending people.

I need to clear up the fact that I do not have investigation results, masonries, tracking, watching, blocking, or any other powers which would lead me to believe anyone is town or scum. Just my instincts.

Honestly, I really should be okay to cold read for intent. You mentioned one motivation, trying to get Lightfoot to save herself.

There are others, I am certain my game is full of really obvious villager tells. But people don't really want to read my posts so I continue to be on folks like dizzy's scum list.

If I must be an investigation then I must, but you won't learn anything you don't already know, that I am a townie who is struggling.

If you check an actual scumbag, that will give us direction. A dead scumbag. Someone we can read for spew.

Seriously, people need to gut check and read me harder or at all.

I put way, way too much of myself, my brain wave, and my motivations into this thread to be a mystery.

Look at people NOT investing in this game. What are they hiding, and why?

You can't tell if they're town or scum by their posts, check those people out.

I should be easy as hell to read by mid-to-late game. Sorry I haven't found a scum yet but my team isn't being very cooperative day one or day two, and I'm just one guy.

We need to get on the same page or it's just divided town, mafia skating to an easy win.

[Sooh]

Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

Look at people NOT investing in this game. What are they hiding, and why?

You can't tell if they're town or scum by their posts, check those people out.

This! A whole lot of this!

[Archangel]

Idrinkthere4Iam, just reread my earlier post and I see it makes it look like you are my number one scum candidate. I didn't mean it that way, rattled off the three names randomly. In fact in order of preference, you've moved to third favorite. Sario is #2 and DoubleA is #1 for me.

[lulz]

Try this. Eat a PB^J sandwich but instead of using bread, use a Pop-Tart or waffles. It'll change your life.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Either have the balls to call me scum or don't. All this soft footing around is pissing me off.

No offense to you as a person. I'm frustrated and there's not three villagers inside Scathach, Drink, and any X player calling me a scumbag.

[idrinkthere4iam]

Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

Either have the balls to call me scum or don't. All this soft footing around is pissing me off.

No offense to you as a person. I'm frustrated and there's not three villagers inside Scathach, Drink, and any X player calling me a scumbag.

You're on my list. Double A is at the top though. Not you. Are you Scum, I have no freaking clue. And I'm not calling you Scum. But I'm mightily suspicious of you.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

You're on my list. Double A is at the top though. Not you. Are you Scum, I have no freaking clue. And I'm not calling you Scum. But I'm mightily suspicious of you.

Why? Name the posts that ping you. Name the behaviors that ping you.

You have one hour to justify your suspicions. Show me the thought process that makes me not on your team if you are a villager.

Show me what process I'm using which is scummy. Show me what process you're using which is what a villager does.

What are you doing to solve this game? Sitting there and going I have no clue but you're suspicious is not solving it or acting like a villager.

If you and I are villagers, and I AM, then I need you to be my teammate for 1 whole hour and respond WELL to this challenge.

[idrinkthere4iam]

Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

Why? Name the posts that ping you. Name the behaviors that ping you.

You have one hour to justify your suspicions. Show me the thought process that makes me not on your team if you are a villager.

Show me what process I'm using which is scummy. Show me what process you're using which is what a villager does.

What are you doing to solve this game? Sitting there and going I have no clue but you're suspicious is not solving it or acting like a villager.

If you and I are villagers, and I AM, then I need you to be my teammate for 1 whole hour and respond WELL to this challenge.

I'm not going to provide exact posts. As I don't them, I'm posting from my phone, and it's not specific posts that make me suspicious. It's your general behavior in this game. Everyone expects you to mix it up and try to confuse everyone, but more importantly the Scum. I've only played with you once before but that's seems to be your style and from what I gather from others I think I'm right. But this game you just stand out as a little over the top. Maybe I'm wrong, only time will tell, and like I said, I've only played with you once, so that's not a lot to go on. But it's that, which made you rise on the list from hovering around the middle.

As I said a few posts above. It was how yesterDay ended. Lightfoot basically commiting suicide so we wouldn't have a tie. Anyone would force a tie, myself included. But only a Townie would willingly die so we get some bit of information. You pushed her lynch hard. You were on at EoD with a chance to save her. You did nothing. That stands out.

As for what I'm doing to solve the game? I'm reading, contributing and theorizing. You disagree, but that's all well and good with me.

Hopefully that satisfies you. If not, then go ahead and vote for me tomorrow. I don't give into scare tactics and I will not take your word as gospel until proof is provided. And no, because you "know" something isn't proof enough for me.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

But only a Townie would willingly die so we get some bit of information. You pushed her lynch hard. You were on at EoD with a chance to save her. You did nothing. That stands out.

Or, I offered her a way out, which was to help me lynch someone else, but not my town-reads.

She did nothing.

So until we agree on what actually transpired, yes, I'll vote you tomorrow. Or Scathach.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

I'm not going to provide exact posts. As I don't them, I'm posting from my phone, and it's not specific posts that make me suspicious. It's your general behavior in this game. Everyone expects you to mix it up and try to confuse everyone, but more importantly the Scum. I've only played with you once before but that's seems to be your style and from what I gather from others I think I'm right. But this game you just stand out as a little over the top. Maybe I'm wrong, only time will tell, and like I said, I've only played with you once, so that's not a lot to go on. But it's that, which made you rise on the list from hovering around the middle.

I want people to seriously consider these words.

What posts or behaviors are suspicious?

No specific posts, just my behavior in the game.

What behavior? What am I doing which is scummy behavior? Why is it scummy behavior and not townie behavior?

What goes through your brain that makes you think why, pizza isn't being a villager, he's a scumbag.

And why does it make you think that.

Nothing, no process, no explanation for why you think the way you do.

Pizza is scummy because I've played with pizza once before and from what I'm gathering from others (Who?) my style is to "confuse people".

I'm pretty sure I haven't been stuttering this game or saying anything too convoluted.

I think X and Y are villagers, and this is why I think that way. I do not want them to die. I have no special knowledge. I do not want to lynch these people because they do not fit what I understand scumbags to do, for these specific reasons.

How come I can say all these things but all drinkiepoo has to say about me is that I am suspicious because I am over the top.

What does that mean?

What general behaviors are we talking about? We're being generic about generic overall suspicion.

Hopefully that satisfies you. If not, then go ahead and vote for me tomorrow. I don't give into scare tactics and I will not take your word as gospel until proof is provided. And no, because you "know" something isn't proof enough for me.

Can anyone tell me how this is a thought in a mafia game that villagers have after I claimed to be vanilla?

"I don't give into scare tactics." No, but you hopped and danced real quick when I told you to come up with reasons why I'm suspicious, the one thing you won't do is provide actual content, just the most generic non-answer that has been provided by any player, under any circumstance, since the game began.

"I will not take your word as gospel until proof is provided".

Oh good, well at least I know where the bar is. If I can get the game host to admit that Scathach is scum, then you will take my word as gospel.

Good to know!

What proof does a vanilla townie provide?

Let me know.

I could always provide you with the same level of answer you're giving here.

Scathach is suspicious because of her general behavior this game, which even though I haven't played with her in a while, I understand to be suspicious. Unnamed others feel the same way. I can't say what she's doing that's so suspicious and I'm not saying she's scum, not at all, just that she is suspicious for her behavior, which I have yet to specify. I will suggest that her behavior is "under the top."

I won't be bullied into thinking otherwise, with all your scare tactics of asking solving questions!

My word, it's just not proper behavior in a game such as this.

You are directing a witch hunt sir, and I want no part of that! Now excuse me while I vote for someone who is acting like a villager, repeatedly, because it tickles my fancy to do so.

You are a cardboard cut-out of a villager, but there's nothing underneath. And the resolution is hardly life-like.

I'm pretty sure setting you on fire will cure you of all your ills, drink.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Or look at drink.

Scum will use the divided town against town and side up with the folks who can't read me to lynch me.

The people who are anti-pizza right now? There's at least 2 scums there. Look.

Look, look, look look look look look. LOOK.

[Askthepizzaguy]

If you guys want me to stop caring and phone it in let me know.

I could do other things than this game.

[idrinkthere4iam]

But it's not that*.

Correction for the end of the first paragraph.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

Not drinking. Well I was. But that's not my excuse. New work schedule. Lack of sleep. That pretty much sums up my absence. Reading now. May post if something strikes me. Otherwise going to bed. New schedule messed up sleep cycle. So trying to get it on track.

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

Appears we will go down this road again...

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

Let it be noted that the last game lulz played here he did the exact same thing. And he was Town.

Bolded.

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

Beaten to the punch. Fact still stands though.

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

No one knows what it's like
To be the sad man
To be the bad man
Behind blue eyes

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

Well I'm not inactive. I was at the time. But I've been here sense. And stuck around. While I don't see his original vote as Scummy, he's been back since I started posting. And hasn't made a reference to the fact that I'm back, nor changed his vote. I don't find him Scummy either way, but facts are facts.

Bolded.

You don't find lulz or Double A scummy.

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

Something about this post doesn't sit well with me. Zeener knows lulz is the vote leader at this moment. His vote is also on lulz. Yet he tells others to not vote based on grudges. He admits his vote is not grudge based, as he was not in the pervious game with lulz, which is a fact. This just smells to me. He is jumping on a wagon when he disagrees with everyone one it. And then in the event lulz is Town an point at everyone and say "well they all voted based on a grudge, I had a real reason." I don't like it.

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

Should matter to you where Scum are placing their votes. Why would you want to vote with them? Also, I'd argue that pizza has been more distracting to both town and scum than anyone in this game. Lulz has hardly done anything distracting in my opinion. He posted a naked vote. Then a random rant about horses. So? There's been a few others posting fluff things. Want an example?

Hey I did it too so don't worry about that. But I'm not accusing others of being distracting.

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

Doesn't that read as lulz in the lead with 4 votes? Or did I miss something...?

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

Oh, my bad. Robot doesn't catch the different names. Ignore my last post. 4-4 lulz and Zeener.

That's it. Double A and Lulz look ordinary to Drink day 1.

Zeener looked like scum and was not.

That is the entirety of Drink's reads.

====================DAY TWO

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

From day one.

You essential vote parked on me Day 1. Also, til our reaction to lulz' post looks like role fishing to me. Basically asking him to provide more about his role PM.

So, for behavior that he did not find scummy on Day One, and with LITERALLY nothing happening since then except his being wrong about Zeener, Double A is now scum.

How's that process working for you?

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

Haven't seen it. So couldn't say.

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

Previously stated? This?

Bandwagon started when Double A jumped on the vote immediately. And didn't really explain why. But since I was reasonable about my reason, I'm the Scum. Got it. Thanks for clarifying. Maybe I should just blind vote next time. That couldn't possibly make me appear Scummy. Shall we ask lulz how that tactic works? Everyone is trying to look reasonable. Don't agree with it, that's fine. But don't accuse me of being Scum because I'm backing up what I say. That's hypocritical.

Wow, this is so villagery.

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

Ok. Let me explain how I play Mafia games. I've a very analytical player. I may not post a ton, I have a very busy schedule OOG and my hours are very erratic at times. But, I read everything. And I weigh it. I make patterns and look for logical explanations in them. I don't throw votes around willy-nilly. Usually I wait near EOD to vote (last 2 days of the Day). I like to have concrete reasons when I vote as well. That's just me. I've only been here for 4 games (maybe 5?). You can look back over them and see. This is how I am in these games. Take that for what it's worth.

Clearly.

I see all the analysis, the logical progression of your vote, and your concrete reasons!

Originally Posted by idrinkthere4iam

I was referencing that you did it. And everyone jumped on you. Then when I provide rationale for my vote I get voted for because being providing reason being why I voted for who I did.

This is your contribution to the game, Drink.

Bottom line: Set on fire, put in the river of death.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I'd spoiler all this, but no.

Take a look:

Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

My list of villagers, based on one hour of effort.

1) Askthepizzaguy, and it should be rather obvious to all of you by now. Sooh hasn't known me that long and she has picked up on it pretty hard.

Reason: I went way outside my normal hurr hurr I'm scum and it was mostly all I talked about day one, and it was in good humor. And it served a pro-town purpose, it got people accusing and stirring and commenting. Plus I don't go this far against the grain as scum, I'm more of a judo champion as scum than a sumo wrestler who forces everyone to agree or makes a big shoving match about it. I opposed too many people's opinions and denounced too many actions here.

I could also have invented even ONE reason to think Zeener was scum to justify moving to him. Please. I'm the expert at that as scum.

I can find the Virgin Mother to be whorish if you give me a scum role, I'll find all the evidence to support it and you'll stone her to death, guaranteed. Me voting Zeener based on nothing but "lulz is town" is why I'm town.

If that's not good enough then you still can't read me and that's fine! That's how I liked it, and it's also just how it should be. Mwa, ha, ha. Etc. Moustache. Evil. Distinguished.

2) Lulz

Because he isn't an unserious trollish mafia player like you folks seem to think he is. I've seen none of that elsewhere. So he's just different, and different is something you can generally control.

You know how I suddenly look a lot less scummy and a lot more agreeable and more rational and fun to be around.... when I'm a scumbag?

That.

That's people knowing what not to say and what not to do when they're scum.

Lulz has demonstrated zero of that and I know he's capable of it because he's not a noob and he has crossed several cultural borders, so he'd know to be extra sensitive to your sensibilities here if he were scum. He'd also be less vocal about calling out so many people. It's just disastrous for his survival. He's a villager, so get the heck off of him tomorrow. I mean it.

Need more evidence, look at his conviction about Zeener being scummy. Scums don't like to bury their credibility so early, and this was from earlier in the round than his imminent death. See 180.

I think Lulz is correct you'll find scum inside Lightfoot, Guiri, and Mahaloth. Not all, but at least one.

I am not sucking up to Lulz. He can find me scummy all day and lynch me like a big fat silly banana. He's just not scum and he's wrong about me being scum. Like a few of you, except some of you are scum.

3) Sooh

Because of the no-vote day one after all the work she did.

She is rapidly becoming an insanely good mafia player because she is capable of fooling me as scum now and she's also become quite adept at reading me, of all people. She kind of puts you guys to shame on that, having nabbed me almost every time I've been scum.

She's been scum enough and seen ME be scum enough that she knows not to no-vote on Day One, especially after I prompted her to vote.

Why because it sticks out. Because it will become the basis of votes in her direction in the future. It already stuck out and people commented on it. And she's not unaware of why that's something to avoid as scum.

So she decided to do that for a different purpose than avoiding suspicion or playing the diplomatic game.

She must have thought it was the best decision for town.

That decision is, uniquely, and for this purpose and this analysis only, a villager tell from Sooh. And unfortunately that's going to result in people reading her wrong, again why I warned her off of doing so.

My fingers are crossed on that assessment, because I do not believe I can say she's villager with supreme confidence anymore. But I still am saying she's a villager. Let's see if I can improve my guess the Sooh record.

_______________________________

4) BillMc- doesn't really have a reason for doing what he did as scum unless both were villagers. But even then.... that's ballsy.

It's not solid, I wouldn't put BillMc out of his scum range entirely for that move but it feels like he was attempting to make a choice to help his own investigation and also he seemed to want to see what I would do.

He's coming to a lot of incorrect conclusions but I can follow why he is. I think he needs to adjust his scumdar to account for the fact that I don't play on such a basic level as scum and my village game is really weird looking and looks scummy as hell.

Ask Giraffe. Poor bastard always thinks I'm scum because it's the only way he can't get fooled by me. Results in more mislynches than successes but hey, at least he can say I didn't fool him I guess.

5) Double A- To be clear, it's not outside his scum meta to not give two shits.

He's done that A LOT as scum. I'm just saying I still get the villa vibes from him.

Buuuut if you wanted to take a peek at him I wouldn't mind.

It would always stop a mislynch this game or nab a scum, so that's a great peek.

And turning him into a murder target instead of a mislynch is still amazing for village even if that's a "wasted" peek because he died, so I feel zero remorse for saying peek Double A and then he dies by murder. Better than the alternatives.

207 looks villagery from Double A.

6) DizzyMrsLizzy- her angst versus lulz feels genuine and her delivery does as well. See 149 and 150, that rings villagery.

Like, really villagery. Not good villaging, but still villagery. Super villagery.

In fact why is she green? She could probably be blue.

I just feel like our brain waves are too disparate for me to read her solidly.

7) Meeko a little bit villagery. It's vague, because it's based on so much fluff. But he lacks an agenda so much that I think he's someone on the town side who dislikes the role he's been randed and is just here to socialize. This can reverse but I see no reason to go there yet.



Some neutralish comments-

Archangel versus Guiri, I would look into that. Arch looks good if Guiri is bad, and vice-versa. See 174.

Drink's vote in 205 could be legit, but it also feels like too much justification. An attempt to make a defensible, yet incorrect vote.

Skip skip skip

Okay opinions on the other side

SisterCoyote, particularly post 49 and 99. Both feel bad to me, meaning not villagery.

I am willing to give her all the space in the world for her real life struggles, but that doesn't invalidate my read on her as not being a villager yet.

I don't buy her suspicions at all.

Guiri. 197 felt terrible. I think bill and mine's reaction to end of day was villagery, Guiri's was not that good. It also wasn't the scummiest thing that happened this game by a long shot. But there's suspicion there.

For all the terribleness of 197, 199 felt better. I'm waffling here, but then...

222 feels pretty rough. Guiri is too good, and posts like this make me feel like he's scummy. 223 feels like the kind of stuff he'd toss at Sooh if he were scum.'

227 he's telegraphing that he will break the tie so the scums get their lynch on a townie, and therefore, that both lulz and Zeener were townies, if he is scum. By the way.

I was literally doing nothing until BillMc's vote at 5:59. I was okay with the tie.

Guiri was not expecting BillMc's move and he was responding to me. That was Guiri breaking the tie, but instead re-establishing it by mistake. Then I broke it with my deliberate response to BillMc, trying to re-establish the tie.

That's how it went down and that's what needs to be looked at soon.

Lightfoot a little bit, because I feel none of her suspicions are being directed correctly. Also her call about BillMc feels like she knows he's a villager. I don't trust that call coming from someone besides me. 148 feels too crowd-controllish.

210 feels much more prescient of the impending end of round than a villager normally would be. I sure as hell wasn't aware it was about to end. Also more concerned about the No Lynch rules than a villager should be.

It hadn't even crossed my mind that there was a tie in progress or how it would resolve until she posted that.

Scathach the scumbag who has to die very soon. So scummy she made me move my very serious vote on BillMc off of BillMc. And I'm glad she did.

All of her posts reek. Literally, all of them. Super bad. 151 is essentially a howl. 157 is the kind of stuff scum think of to accuse villagers. Attacking a villager's thinking process when it's completely normal for them, because it isn't 100 percent logical, systematic, or thorough.

UGH.

How you didn't lynch Scathach day one is beyond my mortal comprehension. Please get your act together and end her immediately day 2.



Everyone else I did not mention has a neutral lean, meaning no lean. I can't see why you're a villager except that it is mathematically likely that you are, especially if I'm correct about several scums. But you could be because you've done nothing outside of what scums can do and have not established yourselves. Get on the ball and lynch my red, and then we'll discuss my orange. Assist me.

For my villagers, I pointed to specific posts, specific behaviors and said why I think they are a bad lynch.

For my suspects, I pointed you to specific posts and said why it isn't villagery.

Day three, whenever it is convenient for you, you can either do the same, or you can be set on fire and hurled into the river of death.

And that's not a scare tactic. It's not terrorism. That's a very reasonable expectation in a game of suspicion where there are a group of people who want to make everyone else die.

It's not over the top, either.

Why is it necessary to have to badger people to provide content?

When you're a villager, you have to provide your actual thoughts and put in effort to solve the game. You cannot just float by like a piece of driftwood.

When you're a scumbag, you certainly can, because you can solve the game at night, with murders. You don't need anyone else's permission and you have no need to build consensus. You can just lean on the ropes.

The people who are providing no content, drifting through each round of the game not being dynamic, and are making no serious effort to convince people to lynch their suspects, but are content to vote for them, those are the scumbags.


Update: Archangel is looking pretty good right now.

[Archangel]

Responding to post #38, but I didn't quote it because it's too long to add further text to.

I've already stated my feelings on you, lulz and Idrink.

I agree with you re Sooh-- if she's scum she's the best scum I've ever seen.

I don't have enough content from Bill to have a read on him yet.

I'm glad to see you're off your tunneling that DoubleA is town. I never played with him before so I don't know his playstyle, but please take into consideration that he was a factor in both near ties/mislynches. I now believe lulz is town, so if lulz/zeener is two town and lulz/Lightfoot is two town, that makes DoubleA look really bad.

I don't have a read on DizzyMrsLizzy yet-- she's too focused on lulz and that could be as town or as scum.

Meeko is starting to bother me the more time goes on. He's getting away with posting nothing of significance without any heat. It's not that different from how he usually plays, but if anything it's less game content than usual, so it's starting to ping me.

Guiri's been pinging me on and off but the more time goes on the better I feel about him. I just can't see him being the 5th vote on a town Lightfoot as scum. Not unless lulz is scum, and I don't think he is.

I also don't think a me vs. Guiri dichotomy means one of us is town and one is scum. I could be scum looking to smudge him, or scum looking to set up a bus on him. Or I could be town being pinged by him either way. Also, Guiri has responded to me in general but hasn't really posted an opinion about me, so I'm just not seeing why you think we're a mismatched pair.

I don't have a read on SisterCoyote other than she always pings me as scum and I don't see her playing differently.

I started out feeling this way about Scathach and Mahaloth, but the more time goes on the more I think they're likely scum. Scathach can get really really defensive when she's frustrated town and I'm not getting that feel out of her. Mahaloth, like Meeko, is posting even less game-related content than usual.

To sum up my ramblings, I think DoubleA is scum. I think you, lulz, and Idrinkthere4Iam are not.

And I think at least one of Meeko, Scathach, Mahaloth and Sario is scum. I'll work with you on Scathach, but in return I ask that you consider DoubleA as potential scum.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Originally Posted by Archangel

And I think at least one of Meeko, Scathach, Mahaloth and Sario is scum. I'll work with you on Scathach, but in return I ask that you consider DoubleA as potential scum.

He's not a solid lock.

I did mention he'd be a great peek, because he's been pushed for the lynch and is hard to read in general, if he sucked up a mafia murder, that's amazing for village.

But look at how he responded to my request for him to leave his vote in a position that causes his own lynch yesterday.

He did it cheerfully and never removed his vote even when I asked him to do so:

Originally Posted by Double A

Well I'm currently in the lead so I might wanna change it eventually.

Anyway, AA <33333333 Pizzaguy 4evr

Originally Posted by Double A

clearly my subconscious was telling me to vote for Drinky because it can sense evil

Pretty sure it bit me in the ass last time I insisted, so go crazy while I set up a tent.

Originally Posted by Double A

Also I think I know what you're doing for once, so that's cool.

Originally Posted by Double A

https://www.random.org/lists/

Originally Posted by Double A

You magnificent bastard.

Originally Posted by Double A

I would offer to come to your funeral, but I'm a little busy planning mine.

Originally Posted by Double A

I am illustrating a point

Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

Double A, you're relieved of your camping on Scathach duties.

This one cannot be allowed to get away today.

Look at the context.

Caveat- this is still within Double A's dngaf attitude.

But seriously. Scumbags do not agree to let themselves hang, Archangel. Not like this.

[Archangel]

Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

But seriously. Scumbags do not agree to let themselves hang, Archangel. Not like this.

We'll have to agree to disagree. I've seen it done, in fact I've seen it become popular to stand your ground when you're scum. Also, he may have known he had teammates that were going to save him.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Originally Posted by Archangel

We'll have to agree to disagree. I've seen it done, in fact I've seen it become popular to stand your ground when you're scum. Also, he may have known he had teammates that were going to save him.

...possible.

I just don't feel Double A plays that way.

You are reading deeper strategies into him than he prefers to play with.

Double A is seriously a for fun player. His tone is spot on for lacking an agenda and not really caring about the risk of death.

If he had a team, he would care a little bit more.

He'd have every reason to question my asking him to keep his vote where it was. He'd be able to go, why are you asking me to let myself hang, Pizza?

Etc.

Just....

Push him down your POE. We also have data on who wants him dead and who does not, from the early game.

If he eats a murder that is so astoundingly good for village over eating a lynch, that's a massive equity swing in our favor, and makes up for one mislynch.

[Askthepizzaguy]

If I need to explain any of this again day three, I am voting for the first person who asks me to explain it.

Call it a scare tactic and I'll leave my vote there the entire round.

[Dizzymrslizzy]

Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

If I need to explain any of this again day three, I am voting for the first person who asks me to explain it.

Call it a scare tactic and I'll leave my vote there the entire round.

Can you explain it one more time.

I'm kidding. I am actually on the same wavelength with you and not on the lynch pizza wave, although I didn't like the push on Lightfoot. Having similar feelings to her I understood her from a frustrated town standpoint. And I wish I was here at Eod to change it.

Anyway, my lead suspect is Guiri. Guiri = scum. Plain and simple. He had a hand in the last two late night vote shifts and I think there's something there.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Originally Posted by Dizzymrslizzy

Can you explain it one more time.

I'm kidding. I am actually on the same wavelength with you and not on the lynch pizza wave, although I didn't like the push on Lightfoot. Having similar feelings to her I understood her from a frustrated town standpoint. And I wish I was here at Eod to change it.

I get it.

At the end of the day her claim was an issue because one shot vigilante and she had scum reads, and she was stubborn about saving herself to lynch Scathach....

It's too easy to pull as scum if she's scum with Scath.

But... I admit, I was uncomfortable with the end of round and wanted her to town-tell or move her vote, a lot.

When she did not I felt it was out of the possible Scath-Lightfoot pairing, because me forcing her into that position is still not townie points for her for lynching her. Not many.

Town points for me, her team still doesn't survive, and better for her to die than bus her own teammate and then die.

That's what I was thinking.

Anyway, my lead suspect is Guiri. Guiri = scum. Plain and simple. He had a hand in the last two late night vote shifts and I think there's something there.

Hmmm.

That's literally my only comment here.

[guiri]

Originally Posted by Dizzymrslizzy

Anyway, my lead suspect is Guiri. Guiri = scum. Plain and simple. He had a hand in the last two late night vote shifts and I think there's something there.

On D1 I moved my vote off my preferred candidate to the more suspicious of the leading candidates to prevent a tie and therefore no lynch. On D2 I moved my vote to the lynch leader one hour before EoD (which happens to be midday Saturday for me, so a perfectly reasonable time to be online) because her claim sucked. I'd expect scum would have been happy to leave town in the dark on D1 and had no need to join the Lightfoot bandwagon so late on the Day after Lightfoot had signed off and Double A was asked to move his vote off Scathach. Unless you're suggesting that I'm scum with lulz and Double A and have voted strategically to protect them, what exactly is your issue with my vote history? I have no defence against "there's something there".

[Askthepizzaguy]

I seriously will stop posting and leave my vote there, because I will be all out of ducks for charity.

[Askthepizzaguy]

If Scathach were townie then Sario's move D2 looks bad.

If she's scum it's more neutral from a veteran player but if Sario is brand new it's more town-indicative.

Please pay close attention to Scathach-Sario, and Double A-Certain Folks trying to lynch Double A, and Archangel-Drink.

Those are dynamics that need to be addressed and cannot and should not be ignored.